Making a Holigay

We’re back with a brand new season! We’re talking about what we like (and don't like) about the holidays to design our own holigay, and playing smash or pass with holiday movie tropes. Finally, we craft an elaborate Christmas movie plot that requires our listeners to act as Santa. Tell us what you think about these Hallmark tropes in the comments!

Follow along on the trope list here: https://screenrant.com/hallmark-christmas-movies-tropes/

Support us on Patreon and get exclusive access to cool stuff here: https://www.patreon.com/thebipod

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The Bi Pod is hosted by Evan Chelsee and Christina Brown. This episode was edited and produced by Evan Chelsee. Our theme song is Coming Home by Snowflake (c) copyright 2020 Licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution Noncommercial (3.0) license. http://dig.ccmixter.org/files/snowflake/61307 Ft: Analog By Nature.

[00:00:00] Welcome to The Bi Pod, a podcast about all things bisexual. I'm Evan and my pronouns are they and them.

[00:00:06] And I'm Christina. My pronouns are she and her.

[00:00:09] We welcome anyone who has any kind of relationship with or curiosity about queerness.

[00:00:14] The Bi Pod is an ad-free community-supported podcast. You can support us for as little as $2 a month.

[00:00:19] To join the community or get more information about the podcast, visit patreon.com slash the bi pod.

[00:00:25] This podcast is one piece of the long history of bisexual and queer discourse.

[00:00:30] We don't know everything.

[00:00:32] At all.

[00:00:33] We're here to be part of the conversation.

[00:00:34] Let's get into it.

[00:00:53] Hi, Christina.

[00:00:54] Hi, Evan.

[00:00:56] Happy holidays to you.

[00:00:58] And to you as well.

[00:01:00] Thank you.

[00:01:02] Today, we are talking about...

[00:01:06] We're going to be creative and imagine what our own Holigay would look like slash

[00:01:14] what elements we would like to have in our own Holigay movie. It's a two-parter.

[00:01:20] Yeah.

[00:01:20] You know?

[00:01:21] Yeah.

[00:01:22] Evan, what are some things that you like about existing holidays that you would like to bring

[00:01:26] to your own invented holiday?

[00:01:30] So the first thing on my list is meal eating as activity.

[00:01:33] Ah.

[00:01:33] Meal eating as activity is good.

[00:01:35] Yes.

[00:01:36] Yeah.

[00:01:36] And this, I feel, is multidimensional.

[00:01:38] There is the piece of...

[00:01:39] I just really like eating good food.

[00:01:42] Mm-hmm.

[00:01:43] Um, but it is a good, like, opportunity to, you know, you get everybody around the table.

[00:01:49] Yeah.

[00:01:49] And it doesn't, like, ask people to do anything that they don't want to do, presumably.

[00:01:54] Whereas, like, my family at the holidays, they would always be like, oh, we should play a

[00:01:58] game or something.

[00:01:59] And inevitably, like, people don't want to play a game.

[00:02:01] Mm-hmm.

[00:02:02] And then you have...

[00:02:03] It just becomes this whole thing.

[00:02:04] Yeah.

[00:02:05] Yeah.

[00:02:05] But the eating kind of serves a similar role of, like, you're all together and you can

[00:02:11] bond over, you know, the dishes that you like or whatever.

[00:02:16] Yeah.

[00:02:16] So, yeah.

[00:02:17] Meal eating as activity.

[00:02:19] That's good.

[00:02:19] Yeah.

[00:02:20] Yeah.

[00:02:20] I would like to keep shiny decorations.

[00:02:23] I love shiny decorations.

[00:02:25] Um, I have shiny things in my house year round, but, like, especially right now, I have

[00:02:30] all my Christmas stuff out.

[00:02:32] It's shine on, shine on, shine.

[00:02:33] Sparkle, sparkle, sparkle.

[00:02:35] I think it's very good.

[00:02:36] And, uh, any holiday that I design will incorporate shiny things.

[00:02:42] I want to have many beverages.

[00:02:45] Mm-hmm.

[00:02:45] And I don't have a thoughtful, like, togetherness reason for that.

[00:02:50] I just...

[00:02:50] I love a beverage at any time of year.

[00:02:52] Mm-hmm.

[00:02:53] And the festivity and the novelty of being, like, we drink this type of beverage at this

[00:03:00] type of year.

[00:03:02] Love a cider, like a hot cider.

[00:03:06] I know you don't drink hot ciders.

[00:03:08] But I get it.

[00:03:09] I love a hot cider.

[00:03:11] A winter wassail, perhaps?

[00:03:12] Yes.

[00:03:13] Love that too.

[00:03:14] Um, that I will drink hot or cold.

[00:03:16] Cold, cold apple cider is just apple juice and apple juice is fine, but it's, then you're,

[00:03:22] you're doing a different thing.

[00:03:24] Is my feeling.

[00:03:25] So, yeah.

[00:03:26] I want many beverages.

[00:03:28] Many beverages at the, um, meal as activity.

[00:03:31] Yes.

[00:03:32] Very cohesive.

[00:03:33] Exactly.

[00:03:33] Yeah.

[00:03:34] Yeah.

[00:03:34] It all goes, like, if you're gonna eat food, you should also have a beverage.

[00:03:37] Yeah.

[00:03:37] Very good.

[00:03:38] Very good.

[00:03:40] Related to you, I like specialty food, especially a dessert.

[00:03:44] I mean, you, you can eat any food at any time, unless it's a seasonal Trader Joe's product,

[00:03:48] in which case you have to wait.

[00:03:51] Nothing gets me in touch with the seasons, like Trader Joe's seasonal schedule.

[00:03:56] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:03:57] Me too.

[00:03:58] That's how I keep time, honestly, is I'm like, ah, the salted maple ice cream is out.

[00:04:02] Must be the fall.

[00:04:04] But yeah, I like the novelty, similar to your beverages of, um, like a food, particularly

[00:04:10] a dessert that, uh, you like don't eat all the time.

[00:04:14] That's celebratory.

[00:04:15] I love controversial.

[00:04:18] Um, I love peppermint.

[00:04:20] I feel like people don't like peppermint, but I do.

[00:04:21] Who are these people?

[00:04:23] Some of them live in my house, if you can imagine.

[00:04:25] Oh, well.

[00:04:26] They have to move.

[00:04:27] I know.

[00:04:28] But I'm not a huge peppermint mocha person.

[00:04:30] I like peppermint vanilla.

[00:04:32] So you get a vanilla latte with some peppermint in there.

[00:04:35] Mm-hmm.

[00:04:35] You're welcome.

[00:04:36] It's very good.

[00:04:37] I also want quality time and also shared space time, which that sounds funny.

[00:04:47] Mm-hmm.

[00:04:48] We're sharing a space time continuum.

[00:04:49] But what I mean by that second part is like when you were doing an activity, like reading

[00:04:55] or something that's like an independent activity, but you do it.

[00:04:59] Parallel play.

[00:05:00] Yes, exactly.

[00:05:01] Yeah.

[00:05:01] So like sitting in a room with someone else, reading a book.

[00:05:05] Love it.

[00:05:06] Excellent.

[00:05:07] Yeah.

[00:05:07] Because you're, you're doing a thing together while both getting to have your own.

[00:05:10] Yeah.

[00:05:11] Individual experience.

[00:05:13] It's very cozy.

[00:05:13] And also like a thing that is sometimes hard to incorporate into daily life because like

[00:05:17] if we're hanging out, I want to talk to you because I don't see you every day.

[00:05:21] I do talk to you every day.

[00:05:22] But or like we got to do the podcast or we're like going to do this thing.

[00:05:26] It's like kind of luxurious to just be like, we're just going to hang.

[00:05:30] Yes, exactly.

[00:05:31] And I also want activities where you are doing them together.

[00:05:34] Evan's like, let's eat, but don't talk to me.

[00:05:39] But yeah, there's just something about it that feels like, yeah, luxurious.

[00:05:43] I also want to have friend activities involved in my, my holiday, such as like a costume party.

[00:05:51] I love a group costume.

[00:05:52] I love a costume party.

[00:05:53] I love going to look at Christmas lights with my friends.

[00:05:56] Um, but like even a friend's giving or a queer miss queers giving as we have done in the past before.

[00:06:04] Um, it's just nice to like get together with friends in like under a particular theme.

[00:06:11] I love a theme.

[00:06:12] Yeah.

[00:06:12] Um, and it's nice to have like seasonal things to do together.

[00:06:16] Yeah.

[00:06:17] Yeah.

[00:06:18] Um, I also like seasonally appropriate outdoor time.

[00:06:23] So like, I feel like in the winter, like looking at Christmas lights is a good one.

[00:06:28] Cause you were like, go for a walk and get a hot chocolate.

[00:06:32] Yes, exactly.

[00:06:33] Um, but even thinking about like watching fireworks together in July, like it's much nicer.

[00:06:41] I feel like to have some outdoor time, um, and do an activity that is, you know, appropriate

[00:06:48] for whatever time of year it is.

[00:06:50] Yeah.

[00:06:51] Yeah.

[00:06:51] You're not trying to like swim outside on Christmas.

[00:06:55] No.

[00:06:56] Although if the pool was heated, I, um, I would, yeah, I would do that, but that's a little

[00:07:01] different.

[00:07:03] I love that.

[00:07:04] I also like traditions that include children, particularly the children in my life.

[00:07:10] I should specify.

[00:07:11] You don't want to.

[00:07:12] I don't want some random kids.

[00:07:14] Um, actually it is kind of, it's fun to like go look at Christmas lights and see kids

[00:07:18] like see things for the first time, even if I like don't know them.

[00:07:21] That's very sweet.

[00:07:21] I'm just imagining my nephew.

[00:07:24] Yes.

[00:07:24] Yeah.

[00:07:25] Yeah.

[00:07:26] It's what's so funny is my nephew's parents like have, they put up a Christmas tree last

[00:07:29] year and they just left it up, which honestly I love that for them.

[00:07:33] It's like in the corner.

[00:07:33] So it's like not strange.

[00:07:35] He's, this is his second Christmas, but last Christmas he was a little tiny baby.

[00:07:40] Um, so I think it's like not weird to him to have a tree in the house.

[00:07:43] Yeah.

[00:07:44] But all the lights and stuff will be new.

[00:07:46] So yeah, it's so cool to watch kids discover things.

[00:07:49] But yeah, I have a very special tradition where I go to my sister's house and make cookies

[00:07:54] with my nieces.

[00:07:55] And, um, actually I was just, I talked to her yesterday and I was like, oh, like the girls

[00:08:00] want to do that this year.

[00:08:01] Like, you know, you mentioned that you're really busy with holiday stuff.

[00:08:05] So like she wanted to check in and she was like, oh yes, both girls have asked me multiple

[00:08:09] times separately when cookie day is.

[00:08:11] And I was like, oh, that's good.

[00:08:13] Cause it's a very special day to me.

[00:08:14] I don't want to like force them to do my holidays.

[00:08:17] Um, but also it's means a lot to me that like, it's important to them and they're looking forward

[00:08:21] to it.

[00:08:21] Yeah.

[00:08:22] And it's a very messy day, but it's really fun.

[00:08:26] Um, and yeah, it's like nice to have that to like look forward to and also to like do the

[00:08:30] same, do something similar every year and like see how they're like different with it.

[00:08:35] Like my younger niece gets to crack the eggs, which is a huge highlight for her.

[00:08:39] The first time that I was like, sure, crack the egg.

[00:08:42] My older niece was like, no, we don't let her do that.

[00:08:44] And I was like, well, what's the worst that can happen?

[00:08:46] And it got really messy, but she talks about it all year about how she's going to get to

[00:08:51] crack the eggs.

[00:08:51] But now, you know, she has like better hand eye coordination and motor skills because

[00:08:55] she's getting older.

[00:08:56] Um, and it's just cool to see, um, and sweet to have those memories together.

[00:09:01] So I want to keep that.

[00:09:02] Hmm.

[00:09:03] What do we not want?

[00:09:04] Is there anything that you were like, leave that, leave that to the straight holidays?

[00:09:10] Okay.

[00:09:11] So the flip side of meal eating as activity is, um, I want to do away with the pressure to

[00:09:19] make, have, or like eat certain foods.

[00:09:24] Like, I think it's easy to get in the habit of like, well, you know, we always make this

[00:09:30] thing and it's like, actually no one really wants to eat that.

[00:09:34] Or like, let's not be weird that somebody doesn't want to eat turkey or they don't like this thing

[00:09:40] or like, yeah, let's have a buffet and everybody takes what they want and whatever quantity

[00:09:45] is good for them.

[00:09:46] And no one has to say a thing else about it.

[00:09:48] Yeah.

[00:09:48] You don't, you don't have to have a turkey Thanksgiving time if you're like, actually,

[00:09:53] yeah, you know, we don't really want to do that.

[00:09:54] Like, let's do away with it's this holiday.

[00:09:58] So you have to like have this thing.

[00:10:01] Yeah.

[00:10:03] Yeah.

[00:10:03] I agree.

[00:10:04] One of my things that I would like to get rid of also is turkey, which is funny because

[00:10:08] I don't eat meat.

[00:10:09] So it actually doesn't affect me, but I'm just like, I don't get it.

[00:10:12] Even when I ate meat, I was like, turkey.

[00:10:14] I've had many a turkey.

[00:10:16] I'm like, it's dry.

[00:10:18] I don't get it.

[00:10:19] The like stuffing seems nice, but like you don't need a turkey to make stuffing.

[00:10:24] And if it was so good, we would.

[00:10:26] Well, it's not really stuffing if there's no turkey involved on account of the name comes

[00:10:29] from stuffing it into the turkey.

[00:10:32] Well, but at my holiday, Evan, you don't have to stuff it into a turkey for to be stuffing.

[00:10:38] You can stuff it into something else.

[00:10:41] Some other thing.

[00:10:42] A gourd.

[00:10:42] Yeah.

[00:10:43] Yeah.

[00:10:44] Gourd stuffing.

[00:10:45] Come on.

[00:10:47] Honestly, I was going to say it'd probably be good, but I don't like stuffing because

[00:10:50] of the seasoning blend.

[00:10:51] Yeah, that's true.

[00:10:52] Yeah.

[00:10:52] You don't like things that taste like Thanksgiving, which is very funny to me.

[00:10:57] And I love sage and rosemary, which tastes like Thanksgiving, as we've discussed.

[00:11:03] But yeah, I'm like, if turkey was good, we would like eat at other holidays.

[00:11:06] Like I just don't.

[00:11:08] And my family actually, we saw, I think that my someone always provides a turkey, but like

[00:11:15] we always have like other meat for the meat eaters because it's like, let's be serious.

[00:11:20] This is a turkey.

[00:11:20] But a few years ago, a friend of the podcast, Henrik, was going to come visit me for Thanksgiving

[00:11:25] and he's German.

[00:11:27] And my parents were like, we have to give him a real American Thanksgiving.

[00:11:30] So they like bought a turkey, which they had no business trying to figure out how to do.

[00:11:34] And then he couldn't come because of like, I think the pandemic and stuff.

[00:11:38] And so then like, I was like looking at videos of like, how do you cut a turkey?

[00:11:42] And I was like, what are we doing?

[00:11:44] Let's just get takeout, please.

[00:11:45] We actually usually, honestly, my family, we'd like just get takeout or like, like a,

[00:11:50] like catering takeout.

[00:11:51] But we're like, no one needs to be doing all of this.

[00:11:55] It's fine.

[00:11:57] Is there anything else that you would like to do away with for your holiday?

[00:12:00] Yes.

[00:12:01] The TV always on.

[00:12:04] Oh, I hate that.

[00:12:05] Yeah.

[00:12:05] It's like there's a parade or there's a movie marathon or there's a morning show telling

[00:12:10] you what you should buy.

[00:12:11] And like, I just, I, I don't, I don't want it.

[00:12:16] Yeah.

[00:12:16] It's very overstimulating.

[00:12:18] Yes.

[00:12:18] Yeah.

[00:12:19] And there's like so many football games on Thanksgiving, which luckily I'm pretty good

[00:12:23] at tuning out, but I'm just like, how could you possibly be?

[00:12:26] Yeah.

[00:12:27] And it's like any one of those individual things is fine, but it's like, we don't, we

[00:12:33] don't need all of it.

[00:12:34] It doesn't all need to be happening.

[00:12:36] Yeah.

[00:12:37] Yeah.

[00:12:37] On Christmas, I like to go on Netflix and pull up the like Yule log video.

[00:12:41] So, which is not overstimulating because there's no narrative.

[00:12:45] It's just fire.

[00:12:46] I would like to do away with compulsory gift giving for people that I don't really know.

[00:12:51] Honestly, working from home has really helped with that.

[00:12:54] I actually like getting people gifts.

[00:12:57] Like, I think it's fun.

[00:12:59] I like to like, I love to like wrap a little gift and like watch a movie, whatever.

[00:13:03] But when I was working in person and just like out in the world more, I guess it was

[00:13:07] always like, oh, this coworker got me this like thing that I don't need.

[00:13:11] And now I'm supposed to get her something.

[00:13:13] And we didn't need to do all of this.

[00:13:15] You know, I do like, like when I used to work in person, I would bring like cookies, not

[00:13:20] the ones that my nieces made because those were not up to code.

[00:13:24] But, um, or like a baked good or something like for the office.

[00:13:27] Like, I think that's nice.

[00:13:28] But then whenever somebody was like, oh, I got you this like hot chocolate kit from I'm

[00:13:34] like, I don't need like you didn't need to spend your money on this.

[00:13:37] I don't need this thing.

[00:13:38] And then I feel like I have to go get something for you.

[00:13:41] Or also like if I'm not sure if we're going to do an exchange and then I get something

[00:13:45] for you and have anything for me, it's fine.

[00:13:48] But then like you're not going to feel like it's fine.

[00:13:50] And I just don't want that.

[00:13:51] I would like explicit discussions about whether or not we're going to exchange.

[00:13:55] And if we aren't, that's fine.

[00:13:57] And if we are, that's also fine.

[00:13:59] But yeah, I feel like I have mostly in my own life successfully done away with that.

[00:14:05] Well, I do have a really fun game for us to play.

[00:14:07] Okay.

[00:14:08] Okay.

[00:14:08] Smash or Pass, a game that we actually play pretty often in various group chats about

[00:14:14] various things you can't actually have sex with.

[00:14:16] But anyways, we started talking about doing this kind of episode because we were talking

[00:14:22] about holiday movies and all of the tropes and the ones that we like that we don't like.

[00:14:57] Yeah.

[00:14:58] I think this is trying to make an old thing into a new thing by saying it's changed when

[00:15:04] it's still the same thing.

[00:15:05] I agree.

[00:15:06] I'm trying to see if they have like an example.

[00:15:09] But all their examples, I'm like, that's a meet cute.

[00:15:11] So yeah, I think I pass on the concept of a meet ugly.

[00:15:17] But a meet cute smash.

[00:15:18] Smash.

[00:15:18] Yeah.

[00:15:19] Number 24.

[00:15:20] Many Hallmark Christmas movies feature former child stars.

[00:15:24] I think it depends on the former child star.

[00:15:27] Lindsay Lohan, excellent in a Christmas movie.

[00:15:30] Oh, yes.

[00:15:31] So.

[00:15:31] She's doing another one.

[00:15:32] Did you see?

[00:15:33] Yes.

[00:15:34] I sent it to you.

[00:15:34] Yeah.

[00:15:35] Yeah.

[00:15:35] That's what made, that's what put her top of mind for me.

[00:15:39] Yeah.

[00:15:39] It looks really good.

[00:15:40] So on the basis of Lilo, I'm going to say smash.

[00:15:45] Number 23.

[00:15:48] Dogs bring people together in Hallmark movies.

[00:15:52] Animal companions are guaranteed romantic catalysts.

[00:15:55] Honestly, it's a pass for me.

[00:15:59] I'm not compelled.

[00:16:01] If Ginger was trying to set me up with somebody, it wouldn't work for me.

[00:16:05] I actually think this is a pass for me insofar as like, yeah, dogs are really cute.

[00:16:11] That's not the basis for being attracted to someone.

[00:16:15] Yeah.

[00:16:16] I feel like it's always like, oh, the dog knows like.

[00:16:19] Yeah.

[00:16:19] The dog like medals in some way that like.

[00:16:21] Yeah.

[00:16:21] The dog's going to bring you together.

[00:16:23] But they don't have that kind of like scheming.

[00:16:25] Yeah.

[00:16:26] The dog's not invested in that way.

[00:16:29] 22.

[00:16:30] Hallmark Christmas movies encourage well-meaning meddling.

[00:16:33] Intervening in the romantic lives of others is a common Hallmark movie trope.

[00:16:37] Honestly, it's a smash for me.

[00:16:39] I think it's really fun when it happens in movies.

[00:16:42] I think it depends on who is doing the meddling.

[00:16:47] Sometimes it's like Santa is involved somehow.

[00:16:50] And I'm like, no.

[00:16:52] No.

[00:16:53] You don't want Santa to meddle?

[00:16:54] No, I don't want Santa to meddle.

[00:16:58] I wish you all could see Evan's hand motion.

[00:17:00] They were just like, talk to the hand, Santa.

[00:17:01] No.

[00:17:02] No.

[00:17:03] Get out.

[00:17:04] But if it's, it's often, I feel like children is a common one.

[00:17:11] Yeah.

[00:17:11] Which I feel like can go some better than others.

[00:17:14] Right.

[00:17:14] Yeah.

[00:17:15] Parent trap.

[00:17:16] Great.

[00:17:17] Great.

[00:17:17] Mm-hmm.

[00:17:18] Or like best.

[00:17:18] I like when the best friends are like, we know.

[00:17:21] Me too.

[00:17:22] What's up?

[00:17:22] That one's good.

[00:17:23] Yeah.

[00:17:23] Um, so with stipulations.

[00:17:27] Mm-hmm.

[00:17:27] Smash.

[00:17:29] I'm like, does it bother me when Santa meddles?

[00:17:33] I guess not.

[00:17:36] If that's what he wants to do, it's fine with me.

[00:17:38] I wish we had a video podcast where people could see the face that you made where you're like

[00:17:41] thinking about it and then you're like, no, it doesn't bother me.

[00:17:45] Slay Santa.

[00:17:45] Go ahead.

[00:17:48] 21.

[00:17:49] Christmas brings creativity in Hallmark movies.

[00:17:52] The festive season always unlocks an artistic spark.

[00:17:56] It's good for people to be creative.

[00:17:57] Yeah.

[00:17:57] Smash.

[00:17:58] Yeah.

[00:17:58] If you want to make a little snow birdhouse, you go right ahead.

[00:18:01] I feel uncomplicated about everybody coming together to host the holiday craft market to

[00:18:05] save the town.

[00:18:06] Yes.

[00:18:10] Hallmark Christmas movies often involve someone changing their career path.

[00:18:14] Romantic leaps aren't the only pivotal moments.

[00:18:17] I'm going to have to, I have to say smash because I, one of the things that I think is great

[00:18:21] about romance that people miss when they're like the romance genre is stupid is romances

[00:18:28] are often a story about like what they really are is people trying to get their shit together

[00:18:34] to varying levels.

[00:18:35] Like sometimes people look like they have their shit together.

[00:18:38] You know, they have the big city job or whatever, but on the inside they're like emotionally

[00:18:42] dead or, you know, maybe their life is a mess, but they have really good relationships,

[00:18:48] but they like can't appreciate those two things.

[00:18:49] So like the romance plot line is actually a mechanism to get people to change from where

[00:18:56] they are to like where they want to be or like they're sort of the best version of themselves.

[00:19:03] And sometimes that involves a career change, you know?

[00:19:06] Yeah.

[00:19:07] Yeah.

[00:19:08] I don't like when it's a career change in a Hallmark movie because of your like new Christmas

[00:19:13] tree farm boyfriend.

[00:19:14] Oh yeah.

[00:19:15] That's fair.

[00:19:15] Yeah.

[00:19:15] But I think you're right.

[00:19:17] Like the first time that I went to Kenya to visit my partner's family, I was like, oh

[00:19:24] no, I'm like a woman with dark hair living in a big city with a vague job in publishing.

[00:19:29] And I'm going back to his hometown for Christmas.

[00:19:31] I am the villain.

[00:19:34] What happened?

[00:19:38] And I, yeah, when it's like, oh, I love my job, but actually I'd rather just like have

[00:19:42] this tree farm with you.

[00:19:45] The person that I just met.

[00:19:46] I don't like that.

[00:19:47] But when it's like, oh, this, this other person or this little town or like whatever it is

[00:19:52] to give me a new perspective and I found a new fulfilling thing for me.

[00:19:55] You inherited a B&B from the great aunt you didn't know you have or whatever.

[00:19:59] And you have to learn about your family history.

[00:20:01] I like those.

[00:20:01] That's good.

[00:20:02] Yes.

[00:20:02] But yeah, you shouldn't just like go into business with someone that you just got into

[00:20:05] a relationship with.

[00:20:06] Yeah.

[00:20:06] You should have some boundaries.

[00:20:07] Yeah.

[00:20:08] Even in a round call.

[00:20:10] So smash.

[00:20:11] Yeah.

[00:20:15] 19.

[00:20:16] Losing a parent adds emotive depth to Hallmark Christmas movies.

[00:20:20] Processing grief is a common theme in Hallmark's holiday films.

[00:20:24] I feel complicated about this because on the one hand I was going to be like pass because

[00:20:28] it's in like so many things like, you know, it's Bambi.

[00:20:32] But then when I read the subtitle about like processing grief and I was like, you know,

[00:20:38] we could all probably benefit from more processing of grief.

[00:20:41] Yeah.

[00:20:41] I don't like it when we just like do the Disney thing of like, let's just kill the mom.

[00:20:44] That'll help give this person background.

[00:20:46] But I do think like, I mean, in real life, we all like holidays and anniversaries are

[00:20:53] like hard from a grief standpoint because those are moments when it's very clear that

[00:20:58] whoever you're missing is not there.

[00:21:00] Yeah.

[00:21:01] And I think that it's like really helpful to have media that shows characters going through

[00:21:05] that because we all have to do that.

[00:21:07] Yes.

[00:21:08] Yeah.

[00:21:08] So I would say I don't feel prepared to say that I smash.

[00:21:11] I was just thinking that.

[00:21:13] For a mode of depth.

[00:21:14] Uh-huh.

[00:21:15] But it's not.

[00:21:16] I'm okay with it.

[00:21:17] Yeah.

[00:21:19] The smash your pass format doesn't quite always fit everything, you know?

[00:21:27] Hallmark movies love main characters coming home for Christmas.

[00:21:30] This one to me, I'm like, yes, it's trope.

[00:21:32] But like also, is it a trope?

[00:21:34] Because that's just sort of the reality.

[00:21:36] Like people, many, not everyone, but many people travel to see their family for a holiday.

[00:21:43] So like when you go visit your family, I'm going to be like, Evan, you're so cliche.

[00:21:48] This is a trope.

[00:21:49] How could you?

[00:21:51] So I'm like.

[00:21:53] Yeah.

[00:21:54] I guess from a movie standpoint, like you could have a story where like the person, like

[00:22:00] you're going on a chowder barge, right?

[00:22:03] No, we've made up.

[00:22:04] Oh, you've made alternative plans.

[00:22:05] But there was.

[00:22:06] But that could have been a good movie.

[00:22:08] Honestly, yeah.

[00:22:08] Meet cute on a chowder barge.

[00:22:13] We're stuck together on this boat with chowder.

[00:22:16] Yeah.

[00:22:16] And it's Thanksgiving.

[00:22:18] There you go.

[00:22:18] Yeah.

[00:22:19] I'm okay with it.

[00:22:19] I also think that like when you go home for the holidays, there's like people like your

[00:22:23] partners meeting your family or like you're re-traumatized.

[00:22:27] You're reconnecting.

[00:22:28] You're regressing.

[00:22:29] Yeah.

[00:22:31] Your new girlfriend can meet your ex-girlfriend, you know, things like that.

[00:22:35] So I would say I'm good with that.

[00:22:37] Yeah.

[00:22:37] Okay.

[00:22:38] I think, again, I'm no comment on this one for the reasons I already stated.

[00:22:43] It's fine, but yeah.

[00:22:46] 17.

[00:22:47] In Hallmark movies, it always snows on Christmas.

[00:22:50] I think the thing is most of these movies are set in places where it would snow.

[00:22:54] Yeah.

[00:22:54] Is it always going to snow on Christmas specifically?

[00:22:58] No.

[00:22:58] But also, if you live in a place where it snows, it very well could snow on Christmas.

[00:23:03] Yeah.

[00:23:03] Now when it's like, it's snowing in Los Angeles, I'm like, come on people, let's be serious.

[00:23:07] And then they zoom out and it's like a snow machine.

[00:23:09] Yes.

[00:23:11] I say that and then we did have the like snow flurries in January last year.

[00:23:17] Yeah.

[00:23:18] I think it was last year.

[00:23:19] I love a Christmas morning.

[00:23:20] Like in a movie, I like it.

[00:23:23] Yeah.

[00:23:24] I mean, people getting snowed in.

[00:23:25] Great trope.

[00:23:26] That's got to be on this list, I would think.

[00:23:28] Yeah.

[00:23:28] I would imagine.

[00:23:29] Yeah.

[00:23:29] That's a hard smash for me.

[00:23:30] Confined spaces.

[00:23:31] It's a whole thing.

[00:23:32] Okay.

[00:23:32] Yeah.

[00:23:32] I guess smash.

[00:23:35] But you don't have to.

[00:23:38] Okay.

[00:23:39] This is another one.

[00:23:39] I'm like, is this a trope?

[00:23:42] Hallmark movies emphasize the importance of Christmas traditions.

[00:23:45] The formalities of the festivities are always celebrated.

[00:23:49] I mean, I guess.

[00:23:50] Yeah.

[00:23:50] There aren't people in these kinds of movies who are like, I hate our traditions unless

[00:23:56] they're the people who are going to be changed by the course of the film.

[00:23:58] We're going to have a new career at the Christmas tree farm.

[00:24:00] Yeah.

[00:24:01] But I'm like Christmas has for many people traditions associated with it.

[00:24:07] So again, is this a trope or is this just a thing that is a piece of reality?

[00:24:14] Yeah.

[00:24:16] I think this is not a Hallmark movie, but I'm thinking of Bad Mom's Christmas.

[00:24:21] Is it two?

[00:24:23] No, no, no.

[00:24:23] It's just Bad Mom's Christmas.

[00:24:25] I'm like, it doesn't matter.

[00:24:26] It's Bad Mom's Christmas.

[00:24:27] I love that movie.

[00:24:28] My mom and I watch it every year that we can.

[00:24:31] But the grandmas come and one of the grandmas is like, we have to go to the Nutcracker and

[00:24:39] you have to light up your house with five million LED lights and you have like, I'm

[00:24:43] trying to have a nice Christmas for your kids.

[00:24:45] They have to do all these things.

[00:24:46] And then there's like tension about like, well, we have traditions of our own and this

[00:24:49] is what that looks like, which is nice.

[00:24:51] I like when people, when characters like interact with traditions or like bump up against them.

[00:24:57] Smash.

[00:24:57] Now I'm thinking about the movie Christmas with the Cranks.

[00:25:00] I don't think I've seen that actually.

[00:25:02] Tim Allen and Jamie Lee Curtis.

[00:25:06] Oh, actually a combination.

[00:25:09] And their adult daughter isn't coming home for Christmas.

[00:25:13] And they're the, like, they live in a neighborhood where everybody does all the lights and they're

[00:25:17] the house that like really goes all out for Christmas.

[00:25:20] And then their adult daughter isn't going to come home.

[00:25:23] And I don't know, it's been a stressful year or something.

[00:25:24] So they decide they're going to like go to Hawaii or on some other kind of like tropical

[00:25:28] vacation.

[00:25:29] And then at the last minute and the neighbors are all very mad about this because they're

[00:25:34] ruining Christmas or something.

[00:25:36] And then at the last minute, their daughter is like, surprise, I'm coming home.

[00:25:41] And so they can't admit to her that they were going to, they don't want to ruin Christmas.

[00:25:46] So then they have to scramble and they try to get all their neighbors involved.

[00:25:48] And I guess really it's about a community coming together, which is kind of nice.

[00:25:51] But I'm like, also, you could just tell her that you.

[00:25:54] Yeah.

[00:25:55] Well, next time plan ahead, sweetie.

[00:26:00] Like if I want to go to, if you were like, we're going on a trip to Hawaii.

[00:26:04] Go to Hawaii.

[00:26:05] Yeah, me too.

[00:26:09] Well, I think this is a pass for me just because I'm like, I feel, I feel neutral about it.

[00:26:14] So I should pass.

[00:26:16] Yeah.

[00:26:17] 15.

[00:26:18] Hallmark Christmas movies regularly include the big relationship misunderstanding.

[00:26:22] Miscommunication is a tried and tested Yuletide drama tool.

[00:26:27] So the thing about this is people love to complain about like, ah, like all of this would be resolved if these people just had a conversation.

[00:26:35] And you're right.

[00:26:37] That usually would be true.

[00:26:39] Do you know how many people in their real lives are not having conversations that would resolve the issues?

[00:26:45] That's like, yeah, that's true of most human, like interpersonal problems also.

[00:26:50] So it's like the main interpersonal problem.

[00:26:53] And so like sometimes I'm like, OK, this person is jumping to a big leap.

[00:26:59] Like they saw a person talking to their ex and they're like, they're going to get back together.

[00:27:04] And then I'm like, is this a misunderstanding so much as like your own deep insecurities?

[00:27:09] Yeah.

[00:27:09] But there are other times where I'm like, yeah, it makes sense that these people aren't talking to each other about it because talking to people about your feelings is hard.

[00:27:17] Yeah.

[00:27:18] If it were easy, we wouldn't have all these movies.

[00:27:20] Yeah.

[00:27:21] So this is one where I'm like, this is representative of real life.

[00:27:24] And people don't.

[00:27:25] People don't like it.

[00:27:26] They don't like it.

[00:27:27] People don't like it.

[00:27:28] That reminds me of The Tragedy of Heterosexuality, a book that I recommend to all my straight friends.

[00:27:34] And like one of the things that the author talks about is the like social structure of like women in relationships with men getting mad at like their male partner and then like going to talk to their friends and like talk to other women about the issue.

[00:27:49] And then they like go back to their partner and like don't talk about it with their partner and like vice versa.

[00:27:54] And I'm like, this is literally like inherent to straight culture.

[00:27:57] So like if you don't like it, look in the mirror, guys.

[00:28:00] OK.

[00:28:01] Yeah.

[00:28:03] Yeah.

[00:28:03] So I love it.

[00:28:05] Yeah.

[00:28:06] Smash.

[00:28:06] 14.

[00:28:07] No Hallmark Christmas is complete without the holiday competition.

[00:28:12] I think it's a pass again because I'm just like, I feel fine about this because I feel like usually the main character doesn't win.

[00:28:19] And then they have to learn a lesson about their self-worth.

[00:28:23] And I'm like, that's a good lesson for people to learn.

[00:28:25] But I don't care.

[00:28:26] Yeah.

[00:28:27] I think I feel the same.

[00:28:28] I think we need like a gradable scale of like how vigorously do you pass?

[00:28:32] Or smash.

[00:28:34] Wow.

[00:28:35] Not the vigorous smashing.

[00:28:38] Okay.

[00:28:39] Yeah.

[00:28:39] I think we're going to switch to fuck, marry, kill.

[00:28:43] Okay.

[00:28:43] This is good.

[00:28:45] 13.

[00:28:45] Even in Hallmark Christmas romance, first love is true love.

[00:28:49] The festive season doesn't make Hallmark break from tradition.

[00:28:53] This is a hard kill for me.

[00:28:55] I mean, sometimes it's like cute in the story.

[00:28:57] But once again, like back to me going to my partner's hometown as the new woman.

[00:29:02] I'm like, no.

[00:29:04] So we should evolve and change.

[00:29:06] And it's nice to like go and reconnect with the first love if that feels good for you,

[00:29:10] I guess.

[00:29:11] But I don't care to see it.

[00:29:12] I think this one can be fun when it's like a second chance romance of like there are reasons

[00:29:18] we didn't work together before.

[00:29:19] And now we have like grown and changed.

[00:29:22] And so this relationship works in a way that it didn't.

[00:29:25] Yeah.

[00:29:25] I prefer that to when it's like, I always loved him, but he was dating another girl.

[00:29:30] And like we were just friends.

[00:29:31] And it's like he was dating another girl.

[00:29:34] So if he wanted to date you, he could have fucking dated you.

[00:29:36] Yeah.

[00:29:36] So like.

[00:29:37] Yeah.

[00:29:37] I love a second chance romance.

[00:29:39] I don't like the you're the first person I ever kissed and therefore we have to get married.

[00:29:43] Yes.

[00:29:44] Yeah.

[00:29:44] So fuck me or kill Evan.

[00:29:47] Well, I'm like now we've introduced it.

[00:29:49] So I would say that to the you're the first person I've ever kissed.

[00:29:53] So we're meant to be.

[00:29:55] That's a kill for me.

[00:29:57] But second chance romance.

[00:29:59] I'd fuck second chance romance.

[00:30:01] Me too.

[00:30:01] Someone sings a holiday song in most Hallmark Christmas movies.

[00:30:05] I'm here for it.

[00:30:06] I'm here for it.

[00:30:07] Yeah.

[00:30:07] I'm Mary.

[00:30:08] Yeah.

[00:30:08] I'm really having to think about like, do I want to be with this trope forever?

[00:30:12] Evan is staring off in the distance, contemplating their future relationship with this trope.

[00:30:18] I mean, you don't really like Christmas music, but I think it's nice when people sing.

[00:30:21] Yeah.

[00:30:21] It's a good.

[00:30:22] So many actors are also, you know, talented singers.

[00:30:24] And but people for some reason don't like musicals.

[00:30:28] I'm going to say fuck.

[00:30:29] OK.

[00:30:29] Now, a musical episode.

[00:30:31] Uh huh.

[00:30:31] Mary, I want a musical episode of every single show.

[00:30:34] I don't care how silly it is.

[00:30:36] Agree.

[00:30:36] Hallmark movies remind viewers Christmas is about more than presents.

[00:30:40] The quintessential holiday TV brand shuns materialism in its stories.

[00:30:45] Do I feel like Hallmark shuns materialism?

[00:30:49] Well, I think that there are movies.

[00:30:51] I mean, like, no.

[00:30:53] They literally have stores.

[00:30:56] But I think it's like, oh, the magic of Christmas is about.

[00:31:00] Yeah.

[00:31:00] It's not about getting stuff.

[00:31:03] Yeah.

[00:31:03] I don't care.

[00:31:04] Kill.

[00:31:04] Yeah.

[00:31:05] I was like, it's all about the gifts.

[00:31:09] Yeah.

[00:31:10] It feels like an empty, like, moral of the story when it's literally Hallmark making it.

[00:31:17] Yeah.

[00:31:17] Quaint small towns are better than the big city for a Hallmark Christmas.

[00:31:22] Homely locales.

[00:31:24] Homely locales.

[00:31:25] Make for the best Hallmark holiday movies.

[00:31:28] Mm hmm.

[00:31:28] I think you have to tell the homely story now.

[00:31:31] So my partner grew up speaking British English.

[00:31:34] And I, you may have guessed, did not.

[00:31:37] And when we had not been dating for all that long, maybe a few months, he came over to my apartment.

[00:31:43] And he used to always be like, would just like be in my pajamas or something.

[00:31:46] Like, I was not putting on errors.

[00:31:48] I was a grad student.

[00:31:48] I had no time for this.

[00:31:49] And he would always be like, oh, that t-shirt looks perfect on you.

[00:31:52] That's the perfect t-shirt.

[00:31:53] And I'm like, I've had it since the seventh grade.

[00:31:55] But thank you.

[00:31:56] But one time he came to the door and he was like, wow, you look so homely.

[00:32:00] And I was like, get out of my house.

[00:32:02] Never speak to me again.

[00:32:04] How dare you?

[00:32:05] And I got up because in American English, that's rude.

[00:32:08] And he was like, no, no.

[00:32:10] Yeah.

[00:32:10] I mean, yes, we looked at the definition.

[00:32:13] But he was like, why are you mad?

[00:32:14] Like, it means like comfortable.

[00:32:15] And I was like, no, it doesn't.

[00:32:17] I never want to see you again.

[00:32:18] Don't come to my house.

[00:32:20] So we looked it up.

[00:32:21] And like in American English, it means boring and ugly.

[00:32:25] And in British English, it means like cozy and of the home.

[00:32:29] And we were like, ah, we were set up to fail in this situation.

[00:32:34] Do you think this listicle was written by a British person?

[00:32:38] I mean, it must be.

[00:32:40] Unless they're like ugly little towns.

[00:32:43] Or someone who's never heard the word homely before.

[00:32:45] So they were just like, sounds comfy.

[00:32:47] Homely and homey, very different.

[00:32:49] Yeah.

[00:32:50] Very different.

[00:32:51] Yeah.

[00:32:51] That's so funny.

[00:32:54] I want to know about the etymological journey of that.

[00:32:58] Yeah.

[00:32:58] Me too.

[00:32:59] I'm like, when did we decide that?

[00:33:01] Because I assume that the British version is older.

[00:33:03] That could be wrong.

[00:33:04] But I'm like, when did Americans be like, oh, it reminds you of home?

[00:33:07] Bad.

[00:33:08] I mean, probably when we split from Britain.

[00:33:11] Like home.

[00:33:12] Home evil.

[00:33:13] Boring.

[00:33:14] Yeah.

[00:33:14] We don't like it.

[00:33:15] Boring and ugly.

[00:33:16] Hate to see it.

[00:33:17] Frontier or bust.

[00:33:19] Home reminds us of Britain.

[00:33:21] We hate that.

[00:33:26] This is the bite put after dark officially.

[00:33:28] Yeah, we're getting real silly now.

[00:33:29] I think it's nice when they're in small towns, I guess.

[00:33:32] But I don't find it relatable.

[00:33:33] Yeah.

[00:33:34] Like it's cute for me.

[00:33:35] I'm like, I don't.

[00:33:36] I liked the introduction of fuck, marry, kill.

[00:33:39] But I'm like, actually.

[00:33:42] Sometimes we just want to pass and that's okay.

[00:33:44] I think most of my like favorite Christmas movies take place in New York or like in a

[00:33:49] city.

[00:33:49] Like Elf.

[00:33:50] Home Alone too.

[00:33:51] So yeah, small towns fine with me.

[00:33:53] I would fuck a small town.

[00:33:55] Yeah.

[00:33:56] It's nice sometimes.

[00:33:57] So we'll say.

[00:33:57] We'll fuck it.

[00:33:58] Certainly wouldn't marry.

[00:33:59] Yes.

[00:33:59] Nine.

[00:34:00] Nine.

[00:34:00] A Christmas ceremony will save the town in most Hallmark movies.

[00:34:04] Yeah.

[00:34:04] I'm down.

[00:34:05] Honestly, I might marry this one.

[00:34:07] Yeah.

[00:34:07] Me too.

[00:34:07] I like it.

[00:34:08] What is a Christmas movie for if not this?

[00:34:11] Yeah.

[00:34:11] I want to see a complicated interpersonal intergenerational issue solved easily with something

[00:34:17] shiny and nice.

[00:34:18] Yes.

[00:34:19] Yeah.

[00:34:19] And honestly, you know, planning a thing really brings people together.

[00:34:22] That it does.

[00:34:23] You got to work in tandem.

[00:34:25] Yeah.

[00:34:25] There's a lot.

[00:34:25] And you have to have a shared vision.

[00:34:27] Yeah.

[00:34:28] Hallmark Christmas movies often opt for a hometown hero love interest.

[00:34:32] Pillars of the community make for great partners.

[00:34:36] I mean, pillars of the community probably do make for great partners.

[00:34:39] Yeah.

[00:34:40] That's true.

[00:34:41] Although, are they carving out enough time for you?

[00:34:45] Or is it all about being a hero?

[00:34:48] Yeah.

[00:34:48] Why do they not move with you to the big city when you moved?

[00:34:51] Do they support your dreams?

[00:34:52] Yeah.

[00:34:53] Or do you have to quit your job to run their little Christmas tree farm?

[00:34:55] Yeah.

[00:34:56] You know, now this is making me think of, what's the movie that we watched with Alison Brie?

[00:35:01] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:35:03] Somebody That I Used to Know or Someone That I Used to Know?

[00:35:05] Yes.

[00:35:06] Yeah, yeah.

[00:35:06] That was actually a great part of that movie.

[00:35:10] Yeah.

[00:35:10] That's a great movie.

[00:35:11] I thought about that a couple times in this conversation.

[00:35:13] It wasn't a Christmas movie, but it has the like...

[00:35:16] Because there's like a wedding thing.

[00:35:17] The underpinnings of Christmas movie.

[00:35:19] Happening and...

[00:35:20] Yeah.

[00:35:21] Why does she go home?

[00:35:23] Because she is...

[00:35:25] Like, she's fired, I think.

[00:35:29] Or does she go home for Christmas?

[00:35:31] I don't even know.

[00:35:32] I don't know.

[00:35:32] But she goes...

[00:35:33] She's like fired from her big LA job.

[00:35:36] Yeah, it has a similar vibe.

[00:35:38] I think it may be as Christmas.

[00:35:40] But I don't know.

[00:35:41] It doesn't matter.

[00:35:41] I don't know, man.

[00:35:45] There's too many options now.

[00:35:47] Yes.

[00:35:47] Yeah.

[00:35:51] I think as long as they make time for you, it's good to be with people who are invested

[00:35:55] in their communities.

[00:35:56] Yes.

[00:35:56] You know what?

[00:35:57] Yes.

[00:35:57] Yeah.

[00:35:58] I agree.

[00:35:59] Okay.

[00:36:00] Number seven.

[00:36:01] Christmas is when best friends become lovers in Hallmark movies.

[00:36:04] I feel pretty neutral about, like, friends to lovers as a trope.

[00:36:11] Sometimes it's good.

[00:36:14] Sometimes I don't find it compelling.

[00:36:16] Yeah.

[00:36:17] But I'm out here, like, enemies to lovers, enemies to lovers.

[00:36:20] The more they hate each other, the better.

[00:36:23] So that, like, is, you know, it's probably tougher for a Hallmark movie.

[00:36:27] Uh-huh.

[00:36:27] Yeah.

[00:36:28] Yeah.

[00:36:29] So, um...

[00:36:31] I mean, that happens, like, you know, angry corporate lady.

[00:36:34] And, like, trying to shut down a Christmas tree farm.

[00:36:37] They're rivals or something like that.

[00:36:39] Yeah.

[00:36:40] Yeah.

[00:36:40] I think I like them as long as they're not trying to say that people of various genders,

[00:36:45] like, can't be friends.

[00:36:47] Yes.

[00:36:47] Because, like, really, you guys are just friends.

[00:36:50] I hate the term just friends.

[00:36:51] Yeah.

[00:36:51] Friends are important.

[00:36:52] I would say it depends.

[00:36:53] Do you think we could fall in love in a Hallmark movie?

[00:36:55] In a Hallmark movie, sure.

[00:36:56] You could fall in love with anybody.

[00:37:01] But then you'd be like, why are there so many shiny things in my house?

[00:37:03] And why does she want to have a baby?

[00:37:05] What's going on?

[00:37:06] It's like after Sidney has left you because, you know, he fell in love with someone from

[00:37:10] his hometown.

[00:37:11] Of course.

[00:37:11] And then...

[00:37:12] And I did not elect to stay at the Christmas tree farm, but they, for some reason, have

[00:37:15] a Nairobi.

[00:37:17] And then I came back to my publishing job and I was like, it's me and my best friend.

[00:37:22] Yeah.

[00:37:22] Exactly.

[00:37:23] It's...

[00:37:23] You didn't know.

[00:37:24] But all along...

[00:37:25] All along.

[00:37:25] We've been in love.

[00:37:26] It was us.

[00:37:28] That would be an interesting Hallmark movie.

[00:37:31] We should write that and pitch it.

[00:37:33] We're, like, doing a podcast, but, like, falling in love.

[00:37:37] And then, like, working out our, like, our grievances on the show.

[00:37:40] Yeah.

[00:37:40] Uh-huh.

[00:37:41] What if we were trying to hide it from the listeners, but then you, like, revealed,

[00:37:45] like, oh, Christina, your socks are here or, like, something.

[00:37:47] But I'm like, everything that usually gives it away of, like, oh, they're dating.

[00:37:51] Like, that's already true.

[00:37:52] Like, you know everything that's going on in my head at any given time.

[00:37:56] Maybe the listeners can meddle.

[00:37:58] Uh-huh.

[00:37:58] The listeners are Santa.

[00:38:00] Uh-huh.

[00:38:00] Okay.

[00:38:01] Listeners, Santa Claus, let's go.

[00:38:03] They're like, for this Christmas, Evan and Christina have to fall in love.

[00:38:06] That's so funny.

[00:38:07] Okay.

[00:38:08] We are successfully building the holiday movie.

[00:38:12] Okay.

[00:38:13] Number six.

[00:38:14] Hallmark Christmas villains are corporate big shot.

[00:38:17] This sentence doesn't make sense.

[00:38:19] Villains are corporate big shot wants to close the factory lodge tree lot.

[00:38:23] They're missing an article in there.

[00:38:26] Yeah.

[00:38:26] Well, that's the enemies to lovers sometimes of, like.

[00:38:30] Yeah.

[00:38:30] No matter the town, there's a business executive who wants to ruin it, which is also, I think, reality.

[00:38:37] Yeah.

[00:38:38] Yeah.

[00:38:38] And they usually don't fall in love.

[00:38:39] They usually just bulldoze people's communities.

[00:38:41] Yes.

[00:38:42] So I don't like it when the, what do they say, big shot?

[00:38:46] Yeah.

[00:38:46] Is, like, romanticized.

[00:38:48] Yes.

[00:38:49] But I do like it when they change their mind and it's like, actually, I shouldn't ruin this town.

[00:38:53] We cannot be having corporate interests win in a Hallmark movie.

[00:38:56] Hard pass.

[00:38:56] Exactly.

[00:38:57] Yes.

[00:38:57] I will marry.

[00:38:59] Okay.

[00:39:00] You already know how I feel about this one.

[00:39:01] Five.

[00:39:02] Santa or his elves interfere in many Hallmark Christmas movies.

[00:39:06] Kill.

[00:39:06] Why do you not like it when Santa meddles?

[00:39:08] Santa should be doing his actual job, which is delivering Christmas presents.

[00:39:13] Wow.

[00:39:14] Suddenly you're like, do your labor and go.

[00:39:16] I mean, or stay home with his wife and drink some hot chocolate.

[00:39:20] Like, stay out of everybody's business.

[00:39:22] You're already surveilling them at all hours.

[00:39:24] Let them live their lives.

[00:39:24] That's true.

[00:39:25] The surveillance is enough.

[00:39:26] You know what?

[00:39:27] You've taken me to your side.

[00:39:29] Yes.

[00:39:29] Let people live their lives, Santa.

[00:39:31] Stop puppeting them.

[00:39:34] It's giving you have some, like, naughty list drama.

[00:39:40] Let people live their lives, Santa.

[00:39:43] Okay.

[00:39:44] We're almost to the end of this list.

[00:39:46] Four.

[00:39:47] Four.

[00:39:47] The kids in the Hallmark movies play matchmaker for single parents at Christmas.

[00:39:52] Presents aren't the only gifts the children get.

[00:39:54] I hate this.

[00:39:55] Something about that subtitle felt weird.

[00:39:59] I don't like that.

[00:40:00] Yeah.

[00:40:01] It's not the only thing that.

[00:40:02] Yeah.

[00:40:02] No.

[00:40:03] I don't like it.

[00:40:04] Children should not be responsible for their parents' love lives.

[00:40:09] Except in the parent trap.

[00:40:10] Well, that's different because it's their parents.

[00:40:13] Yes.

[00:40:13] I mean, they also shouldn't have been responsible for that.

[00:40:16] Like, in real life, they would be, like, super traumatized.

[00:40:20] But if it's, like, single parents, like, oh, I'm going to go find, like, that's not appropriate.

[00:40:24] Children should just be making cookies and vibing.

[00:40:27] I feel personally.

[00:40:28] I agree.

[00:40:29] I agree.

[00:40:29] Although my mom picked out her stepdad.

[00:40:32] And that's worked out pretty well.

[00:40:34] Oh.

[00:40:34] Yeah.

[00:40:34] They met at a furniture store.

[00:40:36] I mean, my mom's mom was there.

[00:40:38] But my mom was like, you should marry that guy.

[00:40:41] And she did.

[00:40:46] But there's no Hallmark movie about it.

[00:40:49] That would be a good movie plot.

[00:40:51] All work, no romance boyfriend is a regular Hallmark Christmas trope.

[00:40:56] I mean, also, there's so many where women are putting their career first.

[00:41:00] Yeah.

[00:41:01] But they're evil.

[00:41:03] Women are supposed to have careers, Evan.

[00:41:05] They're supposed to have Christmas trees and babies.

[00:41:06] I mean, I think in both cases, the plot is learning to love something other than work.

[00:41:11] Although I guess this one is saying it's the, in this scenario, the man who's obsessed with work

[00:41:16] is the bad boyfriend of the heroine.

[00:41:19] Who's then going to find a guy who cares about something other than work.

[00:41:22] Mm-hmm.

[00:41:23] Whereas when it's the woman who's obsessed with work, she's going to learn to love something

[00:41:27] other than work.

[00:41:28] Yeah.

[00:41:29] Yeah.

[00:41:29] The woman must change.

[00:41:30] Interesting that the men are not redeemable.

[00:41:33] Yeah.

[00:41:33] It's like, he likes to work.

[00:41:36] Dump him.

[00:41:39] That's so funny.

[00:41:40] He should be giving of himself to the small town where he lives.

[00:41:44] Yeah.

[00:41:44] Think of the Christmas tree farm.

[00:41:46] He should be beloved by his neighbors.

[00:41:48] Yeah.

[00:41:48] Otherwise unemployed.

[00:41:51] He should be beloved by his neighbors.

[00:41:53] And otherwise.

[00:41:53] You should put, make that a t-shirt.

[00:41:55] Beloved by my neighbors, but otherwise unemployed.

[00:42:00] Yeah.

[00:42:01] I mean, I guess it, for me, this one depends on the, like, the exact vibe.

[00:42:07] I mean, if two people are, like, not working in a relationship, they should break up.

[00:42:11] And then they find other people, I guess, who work.

[00:42:15] Like, that's good.

[00:42:16] But also, usually when someone's really obsessed with work, it's because they're, like, are pressured

[00:42:22] by capitalism.

[00:42:23] And, like, maybe we could examine that, you know?

[00:42:25] I like this in this description.

[00:42:28] Thankfully, while she's traveling to meet said boyfriend, she runs into a super nice

[00:42:32] guy who loves Christmas as much as she does and makes her see her boyfriend for the wrong

[00:42:37] choice that he is.

[00:42:38] Because he doesn't love Christmas enough.

[00:42:42] That's so funny.

[00:42:43] Yeah.

[00:42:44] Two, a successful woman must choose between family and career for it to be a hallmark

[00:42:49] Christmas.

[00:42:50] Women can't have it all.

[00:42:51] You get to keep your job and throw away your children or you have to quit your job to be

[00:42:56] a stay-at-home taco-choco-chookie-dough mom.

[00:42:59] There are only two paths.

[00:43:01] And only one is correct.

[00:43:02] This is a no for me, unless it is the earlier trope that we talked about where you're like,

[00:43:07] I realized that actually I want to make big changes in my life.

[00:43:12] Yeah.

[00:43:12] I think also, like, the specific way that it's often, like, gendered.

[00:43:16] Because, like, the man in the situation often also is employed.

[00:43:20] But it's like, that's fine.

[00:43:22] You're supposed to do that.

[00:43:24] Yeah.

[00:43:25] I don't like it.

[00:43:25] That's a pass.

[00:43:26] That's for me.

[00:43:27] Number one.

[00:43:28] Okay.

[00:43:28] A boyfriend is secretly a prince in the most magical Hallmark Christmas movies.

[00:43:33] Hallmark Christmases are rife with hidden royals.

[00:43:36] Yes.

[00:43:37] Forever.

[00:43:37] Yeah.

[00:43:38] Yes.

[00:43:38] Absolutely.

[00:43:39] I watched at a formative age the movie where Julia Stiles, who I had a crush on, falls in love with some guy at college and then learns that he is a secret royal.

[00:43:54] What movie is that?

[00:43:55] I can't think of the name now.

[00:43:57] It might be, like, The Prince and I or something.

[00:43:59] Oh, okay.

[00:44:00] I haven't seen that.

[00:44:01] Yeah.

[00:44:01] And she discovers this because they get, like, paparazzi'd in the rain or something like that.

[00:44:07] It's very dramatic.

[00:44:08] They make out in the library.

[00:44:10] Why does that live in my brain?

[00:44:14] It's a whole thing.

[00:44:15] So, yeah.